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mishalakOr Uncertain Calculations
I was rather disappointed by COSine in Colorado Springs. I was not expecting an incredible convention, since this was the first year, but it was undoubtedly the least energetic con I have ever attended. We, Rose, Amanda, and I, were not able to arrive in time for opening ceremonies on Friday night. We also discovered that there was nothing else going on that night aside from opening ceremonies. We hung out kibitzing in the consuite for a while and then Amanda, then Rose, and finally myself tried to find something going on. There were three people watching the movie and there was one person besides us in the room designated for filking. I was in high spirits and so participated in doing some acapella versions of Buffy the Musical and trying to remember any other filk like songs. After a while Rose abandoned us for bed (a sensible choice). Amanda and I went back to the consuite for a while and I opened a bottle of port. I enjoyed that with a few companions, but the crowd was rapidly winding down. Supposidly there were 100 warm bodies there somewhere, but I certainly didn't see them
Breakfast with two friends from Colorado Springs was quite nice. I went back to see Barbara Hambly speak about writing while Rose hung out a while longer with Arlen & (drat blanking on his sweetie's name). I was stunned and disappointed to find the consuite closed until 2pm when I decided I didn't want to see the next item in the single track of programming. I wandered around and changed my outfit once before deciding to go on the Book Crawl, a tour of several nearby bookstores. I didn't buy anything since nothing really caught my eye and I have very little money to spend. That was the best part of the convention in my opinion. Virtually nothing else happened before we had to leave for Denver at 5pm.
The convention was far too expensive for what was available in my opinion. The programming was bare bones and the alternatives virtually non-existent. There was no day rate for people wishing to attend only one day and the at the door rate is as high as MileHiCon and the early bird rate for next year is higher than Denver's con as well. Given how it came out I very much doubt I'll go next year, I'd be better off spending my money to get some interesting people to chat with to come over to my apartment.
Some of the chats I had about Worldcon were interesting. Though looking back on it some of them made me feel like I was talking to time-share condo salespeople. While I was in the room with the people advocating it everything seemed so reasonable and doable, but as soon as I get a chance to think about it I felt much less fired up about the idea. Say they are correct about the Permanent Floating Worldcon Committee wanting someone to challenge the Chicago in '08 bid. That's no guarantee that they would give the amount the help needed and a successful Colorado bid would need a lot. Fandom in this state is thin on the ground and the interest in Worldcon is even thinner. Then there is the issue of a lack of experience among Coloradans and we don't have the favors to call in that fandoms with more people involved in helping with the Worldcon have.
In addition I'm not totally convinced that it is true that PF Concom is upset with Chicago. And while I don't know that they could not do a good job they either did not help with COSine or else they were not very organized in getting a 160 person con running. That would not bode very well for a Denver Worldcon bid, if I thought there were any danger that a Colorado bid for Denver would get very far. If they actually start throwing bid parties I'll worry, otherwise I'll just assume it is the same sort of fannish blowing off steam like I do when I talk about DASFA getting a clubhouse. Never going to happen.
I was rather disappointed by COSine in Colorado Springs. I was not expecting an incredible convention, since this was the first year, but it was undoubtedly the least energetic con I have ever attended. We, Rose, Amanda, and I, were not able to arrive in time for opening ceremonies on Friday night. We also discovered that there was nothing else going on that night aside from opening ceremonies. We hung out kibitzing in the consuite for a while and then Amanda, then Rose, and finally myself tried to find something going on. There were three people watching the movie and there was one person besides us in the room designated for filking. I was in high spirits and so participated in doing some acapella versions of Buffy the Musical and trying to remember any other filk like songs. After a while Rose abandoned us for bed (a sensible choice). Amanda and I went back to the consuite for a while and I opened a bottle of port. I enjoyed that with a few companions, but the crowd was rapidly winding down. Supposidly there were 100 warm bodies there somewhere, but I certainly didn't see them
Breakfast with two friends from Colorado Springs was quite nice. I went back to see Barbara Hambly speak about writing while Rose hung out a while longer with Arlen & (drat blanking on his sweetie's name). I was stunned and disappointed to find the consuite closed until 2pm when I decided I didn't want to see the next item in the single track of programming. I wandered around and changed my outfit once before deciding to go on the Book Crawl, a tour of several nearby bookstores. I didn't buy anything since nothing really caught my eye and I have very little money to spend. That was the best part of the convention in my opinion. Virtually nothing else happened before we had to leave for Denver at 5pm.
The convention was far too expensive for what was available in my opinion. The programming was bare bones and the alternatives virtually non-existent. There was no day rate for people wishing to attend only one day and the at the door rate is as high as MileHiCon and the early bird rate for next year is higher than Denver's con as well. Given how it came out I very much doubt I'll go next year, I'd be better off spending my money to get some interesting people to chat with to come over to my apartment.
Some of the chats I had about Worldcon were interesting. Though looking back on it some of them made me feel like I was talking to time-share condo salespeople. While I was in the room with the people advocating it everything seemed so reasonable and doable, but as soon as I get a chance to think about it I felt much less fired up about the idea. Say they are correct about the Permanent Floating Worldcon Committee wanting someone to challenge the Chicago in '08 bid. That's no guarantee that they would give the amount the help needed and a successful Colorado bid would need a lot. Fandom in this state is thin on the ground and the interest in Worldcon is even thinner. Then there is the issue of a lack of experience among Coloradans and we don't have the favors to call in that fandoms with more people involved in helping with the Worldcon have.
In addition I'm not totally convinced that it is true that PF Concom is upset with Chicago. And while I don't know that they could not do a good job they either did not help with COSine or else they were not very organized in getting a 160 person con running. That would not bode very well for a Denver Worldcon bid, if I thought there were any danger that a Colorado bid for Denver would get very far. If they actually start throwing bid parties I'll worry, otherwise I'll just assume it is the same sort of fannish blowing off steam like I do when I talk about DASFA getting a clubhouse. Never going to happen.
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Date: 2004-01-19 08:59 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-01-20 09:58 am (UTC)I dunno. As handy as having a worldcon would be in Denver, I've really got to agree with you on the convention handling. It sounds like CoSine didn't attract enough people wanting to work on it, and the folks who are already working on MileHigh Con seem happy enough with what work they already have!
Now I just need to get a new job so I can go to a worldcon sometime and see how much fun it is.
-john
If there's anyone
Date: 2004-01-26 07:03 am (UTC)Re: If there's anyone
Date: 2004-01-26 02:32 pm (UTC)Re: If there's anyone
Date: 2004-01-26 07:59 pm (UTC)People who have worked world cons and are interested are Sourdough Jackson and his wife Gail. Susan Carnival Reese who Chaired DenventionII would be interested in helping. Ben Miller who has been on the World con Committee for more years then I can't count. Kent would make the perfect Chairman. He may be a little conservative but he is more then qualified. These are just some of the people. Finding people is not a problem and with modern technologies having people from out of state running some of the positions is not as big a deal as it use to be.
FYI If you haven't heard my husbands famous Chicon filk(This is not the only worldcon filk he has written) you should listen to, to understand why they are concerned about Chicago.
Why does it have to been any one group running a WorldCon (MileHiCon, Dasfa, First Fandom, etc.) Why not people form some of each? There is also a large group of people who go to Worldcon's that do not do a lot of stuff locally, these people would be the most qualified. There are also allot of people who would jump in once we got the bid.
I know that I can run bid parties at most of the key conventions like LOSCON's ( I've worked them for the last 4 years), WesterCON's, Worldcon 2005, 2006, and Maybe 2004 depending on finances but I know people who are already going.
I have also been told by Scifwa( World writers assc.) and asfap (world artist assc.), that they would support our bid.
This is something that I have been working on for two years. I came to Kent a year and a half ago and said I wanted to run a world con and that I had he support of Sciffi( La worldcon organization). He said the two things he saw as a problems where facilities(which I assured him was being taken care of he didn't believe me) and having enough experienced people in close proximity (which due to better technologies eliminate this problem). You showed him that what I had been saying was true and that it was possible.
Re: If there's anyone
Date: 2004-01-27 05:18 am (UTC)I'm just sitting here looking at the numbers of people who go to Worldcon from Colorado and kinda going, "How much local interest is there?" I know that 66 Coloradans went to Conjose. I don't know how much support that will translate into.
I guess what I'm going on about is that I'm a real "Show Me" sort of guy. I don't believe in it until it is actually happening. What I have heard so far could just be the usual fannish blowing off steam. You must admit that fans do that a lot. So it is hard to tell when a group of fans is serious about something or not. If there is a bid party this year I'll start believing it could happen. I know Mike said the bid wouldn't need to do a bid party until next year, but honestly I don't see how that could possibly work out unless the Chicago bid is not only facing hostility but totally incompetent in spinning things.
Gah this is going on so long I should do another post about Worldcon.
I disagree on both points
Date: 2004-01-26 06:56 am (UTC)http://www.livejournal.com/users/iamcompubear/5030.html
This was not meant to be a very big convention. There was no lack of help for the size. I enjoyed the laid back relaxacon style. If I were you I wouldn't be so quick to dissmiss it. It also depends on what you are looking for in a con, make some suggestion's. I'm sure i will be larger next year.
As for WorldCon. There are a lot more people here then you know that have the experiance to run a Worldcon. There are also people here who have the support of the Floating Worldcon Committee. I am long time friends with the Los Angeles branch and Great Britten. My Husband has been on the Floating worldcon committee for 30 years. he also has connections with Phoenix. There are people in DASFA that would be interested in and have the experience. Fandom here is not fragmented, so much as spread across a large area and not all are in DASFA. There are enough people locally to run the stuff locally that needs to be run locally. Los Angeles fandom has already said they would help out and considering they are running LAcon IV think they have the experience. Great Brittan has said they would run security and operation as usual so thats covered. Really right now the question is the building of the convention center and hotel space.
I wouldn't give up on the idea yet. With all the work that is required to put on such a convention everyone is going to have to ask themselves why they would want to put in so much work? For me it is so all my friends from around the world that attend worldcons will come out and see our beautiful state and my home I am so proud of.
Re: I disagree on both points
Date: 2004-01-26 02:21 pm (UTC)I like small conventions. I go to Bubonicon & Karval Kon every single year. The trouble is that I felt like I didn't get value for my money. COSine cost more than MileHiCon last year or either of the two other cons I mentioned. Making my own fun is great, but why the heck was all that space purchased if this was going to be a relaxicon? And in a relaxicon I would expect the consuite to be the center of activity and not closed more than half the day.
Being friends with the PF concom isn't good enough to run a con. You've got to be one of the people who goes every year to help out to have the pull to bring them in from what I know. I'm friends with large numbers of Worldcon people too, but I certainly wouldn't have the juice to either run a Worldcon (terror, dread) or the favors to call in to get Permanent Floating Worldcon Committee members to help out. And none of that matters because I've not seen the interest among Dasfans or members of other fan groups. I get around, I do know a bit besides just DASFA.
You say there are all these people who would help out, can you name some names so I can check it out for myself? I've checked with some of the people mentioned in the past as being enthusiastic, like Bruce Miller, and he didn't have the same reaction that was described by the con proponents. So I'm rather skeptical of claims that there are people who have said they would like to help out. If there are I'll gladly admit I was wrong, but until then I'm going to stay with "I'll believe it when I see it".